Toonopinion

My hero can beat your hero

I've said it before, and it still is true….if you want to turn a conversation into an argument, discuss politics, religion or Star Trek. I'm going to have to upgrade that though, to include science fiction and comic books.

It's an old argument…could Superman beat the Hulk? Could Batman beat Captain America? All it takes is for someone to ponder could this fictional character win a fight with another fictional character and it's on. In a perfect world, fans can discuss something like that and do so amicably. Well, not anymore…not with the internet. Any such discussion will almost always devolve into people attaching "rules" to the fight ("Hulk could beat Superman if Superman doesn't use his power to fly", etc) , or giving one combatant some weird advantage ("Hulk can absorb more gamma radiation to make himself stronger"). Think I'm kidding? Google up "Could *insert favorite hero* beat the Hulk or whoever". You'll eventually find a thread where people are arguing so passionately about it you'd think there was money riding on it. For the purpose of this article I'll stick with the age old premise of Marvel vs DC even though you can include any franchise in the argument. (Star Wars vs Star Trek, etc). Even if you ignore the fact that we're talking about people that don't actually exist, the fact is the winner is going to be

A. Whichever character is popular at the moment
B. Whichever character the writer wants to be the victor.

I recently saw someone post a meme on a comic book forum about Aquaman. This meme is not the one I saw, but the general idea was that the poster really like Aquaman. Hey, no harm, Aquaman isn't a bad character. He's been around for more than 50 years and at one point had his own Saturday morning cartoon show. It didn't take long for someone to post that Marvel Comics equivalent to Aquaman, Namor, the Sub-Mariner could beat Aquaman because "Aquaman sucks". After one or two posts about how the two heroes measure up it then turned into "You guys are pathetic *expletive* fanboys because my favorite is da coolz and you all suck!". I'm not kidding, and the language was a lot more, eh, 'colorful'.

I didn't have a dog in that fight, (I happen to like both characters) but I did mention that in a Marvel vs DC Crossover Aquaman did beat Namor. Oh boy….I got called everything but a child of God. You would think that I would have responded in kind, but I didn't. Does it matter? Who cares if Aquaman won a fight with Namor in a crossover book? They don't even live in the same universe and the crossovers aren't considered canon. But apparently some people get seriously bent out of shape if their favorite doesn't win in these matchups. (I personally thought that in the Marvel vs DC crossover it was ridiculous to have Marvel's Wolverine beat DC's Lobo, but I didn't cry about it. Wolverine was the more popular character so there was no way he was going to lose).

Now, this is purely my opinion but when you pit these characters against each other, if you're going to be fair, you have to consider what they actually can do. So I'll try to give my even handed 'toonopinion on some of the more popular hero vs hero fights.

Lets start with the one I mentioned above.

Aquaman vs Namor, the Sub-Mariner

In a lot of ways both characters have similar abilities. They're both amphibious, they weaken slowly when out of water for some time, and they're both "Kings of Atlantis/the Seven Seas". By their very nature to withstand crushing ocean depths both are superstrong and can swim at ludicrous speeds. However…..Namor can fly. (supposedly because of the little itty bitty wings on his feet. Yeah, that makes no sense, but he's a comic book character, roll with it) He's also demonstrably stronger than Aquaman muscle wise. I reach that conclusion by the fact that he has fought the Hulk to a standstill, taken on The Avengers (to the point that they even dreaded fighting him) and battled the Fantastic Four several times in the past and walked away unscathed.

Aquaman is physically strong enough to fight Namor hand to hand, and he seems to be a bit smarter. Which is a plus. A smart fighter can beat a stronger opponent. But the big thing is Aquaman can control sea life. (that's how he beat Namor in the crossover). I'd really like to declare him the winner in this, but that Aquaman was several retcons ago (when he had a harpoon hand). I think it would be a draw, with Namor having the edge for pure aggressiveness.

My 'toonopinion: A draw, with Namor having an advantage.

Superman vs Hulk

If you look online at Youtube you may find several fan made fights between these two. Both characters are considered the strongest physically in their respective universes.

Hulk fans HATE this, but here it goes....Superman has like a thousand superpowers. Most of them though were purely Silver-Age silliness (super-mathematics?) so let's stick with the ones that are consistent through Supe's history. He's ridiculously strong, invulnerable (the only thing he isn't completely resistant to is kryptonite and magic) he has super-speed, can fly, has X-ray vision and can burn stuff up real good with his heat vision. He can even survive and fly in the vacuum of space. During John Byrne's reboot of Superman after the miniseries "Crisis on Infinite Earths" in the 80s Superman was portrayed as not uber-powerful as he usually is and he could STILL do all of those things.

Hulk,though? Hulk has fought practically everyone in the Marvel Universe. He's at least as strong as Superman and he gets stronger when he gets angrier. He can't fly, but he can leap for miles. (which ironically is how Superman used to get around when he was first created, until they decided "just make him fly"). Even when he does get injured or hurt he heals so fast its almost negligible. Hulk has the disadvantage of being kind of dumb. Even though he has at times retained his human intelligence that works against him in this fight. Being smarter keeps him from getting super angry as fast and that keeps him from getting stronger and stronger.

My 'toonopinion: Superman wins. He's matched evenly in strength and he can punch the Hulk 500 times in a few seconds with superspeed. Not to mention he can just grab the Hulk and fly him into space and throw him to the moon or something. Hulk can't breathe in space. I've seen Hulk fans get really upset about this kind of conclusion, but realistically, Superman would have to purposely throw this fight to lose it. He just has too many abilities at his disposal. Also, Hulk fans hate to realize that Iron Man and Doc Samson have knocked the Hulk out before in the comics and neither of them are near Superman's level of power.

Superman vs Thor

We've already talked about what Superman can do…how do I think he matches up against Marvel's Thor? Well, just as Superman is considered the DC Universe's most powerful Hero, Thor is considered the Marvel Universe's most powerful hero. In many old Avengers stories Thor is usually the one the Avengers rely on to be the "Big Gun" when the chips are down. (…and after him, The Vision, and then Iron Man.) He's the Norse God of Thunder, so as deity his immortal. He can control the weather, summon storms and hurricanes, and lightning and his magic hammer, Mjolnir can do all kinds of incredible things. (I've read stories where he actually opened a space warp with it….and it didn't even seem silly or over the top). Thor has battled the Hulk to a draw on several occasions, so its fair to say he and Superman are relatively equal in raw strength.

My 'toonopinion: Sorry Superman fans, but I think it would be close but Thor has an advantage. First, he's a deity, so Superman really has no protection from harm with him. Superman is vulnerable to magic and Thor's powers are magic. Thor is also immortal and a Viking to boot. Meaning he's a straight up warrior with the fighting skills to back it up. Superman has always relied on his powers to make up for any skill at fighting, while Thor has been fighting monsters and evil gods for millennia. I'm not saying Superman couldn't give Thor a good whooping, but in the end Thor would most likely win. The best would be a draw. (as this site explains, the two are equally matched in most ways) I am aware that they've battled in crossovers before and Thor usually ends up with the short end of the stick. That's pretty much because Superman is more popular than Thor, theres no way the less popular hero gets to beat up the one that draws in big bucks. Thats how wolverine beat Lobo in the Marvel vs DC Crossover. (even die hard Wolverine fans thought that was a bit too much)

These are only my opinions, but they are as valid as any other. Plus, this guy agrees with me, too. It's all good, though, I like both characters, I just don't think Superman should automatically win just because he's Superman. Let me put it this way....I'm a big fan of The Thing but I can easily accept that he gets his butt kicked by the Hulk every time they fight.

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